Thanks for this! These kinds of things are what causes younger pastors to what to extend the stiff arm to the SBC. More on that later today... www.baptist21.com

Ed, thanks for the fair and biblical comments. I appreciate hearing from people who know Mark well. Your relationship with him is a picture of how people can partner when they disagree.
Gordon

Thanks for the post, Ed. Good stuff...as always.

Thanks for this! These kinds of things are what causes younger pastors to what to extend the stiff arm to the SBC. More on that later today... www.baptist21.com

Thank you for your transparency on this subject. It is refreshing to hear you discuss present issues in a public forum with such honesty.

Your ministry is vital to the SBC and I thank God for your work.

Right on, Ed! Extremely well said! We need more folks with your view on this. Because as we see, the press loves to sensationalize this stuff when there are a few vocal dissenters. I know God can redeem bad press, but it's still hard to stomach.

Well put, thank you Ed.

Well said, Ed.

Ed,
These are really important points. Aarron Schwartz at your church taught on accountability awhile back, and he suggested that when we hold someone accountable they have to know we are on their side. If we are just looking for something to use to tear down our pastors, we will always be able to find it, and the only way to respond is to be defensive. Instead, if we can challenge our pastors and leaders with some measure of humility and the desire for them to walk in their calling in the best way possible, I think it will be received.

Part of that is rejoicing when there is repentance. I honestly had not heard that Mark had repented, and that says something. We are quick to point out faults, but not very quick to follow up on the repentance and spread that word as quickly.

The church is diverse, and that means there will be disagreement. We need more like you who are willing to speak up when something seems amiss, but does so with the goal of bringing that pastor encouragement to excel in his calling. Ultimately it is a desire for God to be glorified through His church...tearing each other down just doesn't bring much glory to God.

Thanks for these words, Ed, and for following up on your status / twitter comments.

Great post Ed. It amazes me how many people will get fired up about Driscoll and have never listened to one of his sermons in its entirety. I had the opportunity to read an advance copy of his piece in the upcoming issue of Bible Study Magazine and it just reaffirms that even if he is a little too rough around the edge for some, he is a brother that loves Jesus and believes the Bible. That goes far in my book. Thanks again for this post!

(Also, Logos is transcribing and publishing all of Driscoll's sermon archive for those who might be interested)

Thanks Ed. Once again you are leading well those of us who lead.

"Mark Driscoll is a friend who labors for the glory of God, the health of the church, and the redemption of the world. I am grateful for my brother, and am praying for his continued usefulness for the Kingdom of God today." That says it all for me. Thanks for stating it. "Can you hear me now?"

Ed, this is exactly what needs to be said.

I think the most important quote from the Driscoll piece on ABC was:

“I think, to be honest with you, humility is something that, by God’s grace, I’m learning,” he said. “I would not pretend to be an expert in humility.”

For those familiar with Driscoll, this quote is where the real story is.

More here:
http://michaelkrahn.com/blog/2009/01/24/mark-driscoll-on-abcs-nightline/

Thanks for this, Ed. It is amazing to me how people in the church (and people working for a SBC entity) want to spend their time tearing other people down, rather than responding in grace towards a brother in Christ.

And it frustrates me even more when my tithe money trickles down through the CP to fund their graceless reporting

Ed,

I appreciate your thoughts on this, your friendship with Driscoll and your confrontation of him in the past.

It's certainly true that BP could have and should have likewise gone after a certain prominent SBC pastor who has done much worse than Mark Driscoll in promoting sex, even to the point of bringing a bed onstage, and who also puts far less meat on the table in his teaching.

But I simply want to point out that the weblink that the BP article mentions isn't "old news" by any means, (it is still linked on the Mars Hill site as I type this comment) but is yet another example of what is sadly a continuing pattern of questionable judgment on this issue. Whatever opinion we may have of Slice of Laodicea, the information in the BP article was not factually inaccurate. On Timmy Brister's blog, the iMonk (certainly no fundy by any stretch) called Mark's action in linking that site "a serious piece of stupid."

As for the "younger leader" thing, see my blog for a perspective that demonstrates that "younger leaders" aren't of one mind on these kinds of issues. I agree that most churches would be well served to talk about sex from a Biblical perspective more often. However, those who set up a false dichotomy between not talking about sex at all and linking to questionable sites that may cause some to stumble (I'm not saying that you personally are guilty of this, but some are) are going to see some younger people "extend the stiff arm" to those who, if they do not approve of such activity themselves seem to only see the politics involved in episodes like this.

Driscoll is helping us uniquely by saying and writing things that no one else will. "Porn Again Christian," being a recent example. I so needed this resource for young men, but who's going to write something like that? Thanks Mark...And it's free!

Hey Bro, You make me proud to send my $ to Nashville....Well done, sir.

We, as The Church, need to pick better enemies. We're spending far too much taking pot shots at each other, criticizing each other for what we do (or don't) teach, what we say, how we say it, etc. It's not Dricoll vs McClaren, nor Emergent vs Charismatic, or us vs the world. It's not us vs anybody. Our job is not to create dividing lines in which we must separate everyone into distinct groups based on what they believe, but rather to engage a 21st Century world in building strong foundations in the Kingdom of Jesus
and being an expression of the culture of His Kingdom. I'm glad to call an extremely diverse group of pastors and teachers my friends. We don't agree on everything, and there are times that we have private discordance, but we are not enemies. We have better things to fight against than each other.

I read somewhere that whatever a person sows, he will reap. We need to be so careful don't we? A reputation in a moment can be shot, and how long does it take to rebuild?

Ed,

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on Driscoll. I have heard a great deal about Mark Driscoll and the controversy surrounding him. But my exposure to his ministry tells me that he is preaching the gospel and reaching people in one of the most unchurched parts of our nation. He's certainly not against us - he must be with us!

It is frustrating how we tend to "heresy hunt" in the church. Just because someone is different or a little "rough around the edges" we want to point fingers and demonize them. I am so grateful that you were bold enough to identify yourself with Mark Driscoll and to point out the progressive transformation he (and all of us) are going through - becoming more and more like Christ. I'm not there yet myself, and a lot of grace would be appreciated. So I choose to extend that grace to others as well.

Thanks for your work! Looking forward to reading more.

great article Ed! i blogged about this issue yesterday, but your is so much smoother. thanks for the lesson on how to respond to critics. mark is blessed to have your friendship.

What I appreciate about Driscoll is that he regularly repents and at the same time keeps his edge. When was the last time any of the high profile prosperity-wimps repented of their limp doctrine?

He's preaching to people that need someone with an edge. His doctrine is sound, he sees his weaknesses and refuses to hide them but rather repent openly. We should all be taking notes...

Would BP or anyone else call out a pastor by name if their church was consistently doing nothing for Christ, just rechurching the churched and lulling believers to sleep?

Ed, Thank you for this. Thanks for using your discernment and writing a great response to a bad situation. I hope the BP will take after you and use a little forethought before writing anything else.

I appreciate your words. You are brilliant, again.

I am calling for a realignment toward the real enemy (not to be confused with enema):http://acts29network.org/acts-29-blog/lets-move-on/

People attack Mark Driscoll because they're scared of him. They're scared of the real, honest, biblical, and somewhat messy form of Christianity he advocates. When he attacked the home school nazis and "bomb shelter" crowd at SEBTS for wanting to get through life with as little contact with sinners as possible, I knew it would be only a matter of time before new attacks were raised. It rather disgusted me however that they came in the avenue of BP this time (a SBC entity). Godspeed Mark Driscoll! Godspeed Ed Stetzer!

I live near Seattle. I have been a many Driscoll-led conferences and seen the fruit of their church planting first hand. I have also had involvement with the Acts 29 Network.

I have some disagreements that I will not mention here.

That being said, I do not make public criticism of Driscoll by name for 2 reasons.

1. I don't know him personally and have since I have no relationship I feel that I should keep silent.

2. More importantly, none of my criticisms are about the Gospel Driscoll preaches. IMHO, he preaches the Gospel of Jesus Christ and so I applaud my brother for his willingness to give Jesus to the world.

Thanks for this post Ed. I wrote a rather pointed note to BP expressing my profound disappointment with their blatantly one-sided and seemingly unresearced article. Your response was, fortunately, more level-headed and articulate.

OK, it seems a lot of the controversy was over the link to a christian sex advice web site, and so I went there to check it out first-hand...ok first of all, I use a well-known filtering software that generally catches everything that may be inappropriate, and it let me through. So, the site is not overtly pornographic in any way. After reading few minutes, I found that the folks who post on the website are guilty of the following:

1) discouraging adultery
2) discouraging pornography
3) answering honest questions from young christian couples
4) educating christian couples in how to please one another and God
5)encouraging faithfulness to one's spouse
6) protecting the sanctity of the marriage bed
7) encouraging respect for one's spouse
8) giving honest advice...and a whole host of other "sins"

seriously, even if you disagree with some of the conclusions, isn't there much to applaud here? Shouldn't we contribute to the discussion, disagreeing when necessary, rather than shutting things down? If someone can point me to something that is overtly against scripture and contrary to christian ethics on this site, I might change my opinion, but until then I applaud them, I applaud pastor mark for linking to them, and plan to spend some time there myself....

Seeking to honor God,
Tim Cook

Driscoll's frank language sometimes makes me uncomfortable but, then again, so does the Apostle Paul's. In the 4th Century, Chrysostom defended the Bible among Greeks who considered it too vulgar to be the Word of God. No doubt, someone will always be accusing clear, frank preaching as being too vulgar.

an addendum to my earlier comment...the link from Mars Hill's website plainly says that they do not endorse the whole website, and I have found a few things that I disagree with personally as well. With that disclaimer, there should be no scandal about this. And, even though I disagree on some things, it is obvious that the ladies on this site seek to make christian marriage both exciting and holy and to glorify God. May their tribe increase...

Thanks for the clarification! I had read the BP articles and it caused some concerned, but you brought the truth to light. It is amazing the misleading that can be done by individual agendas.

Great job Ed. I listen to Mark regularly.

It appears, IMHO, that the SBC is a little like the balloon factory and Mark is the unicorn, to use the analogy from the book Tribes.

The SBC is fighting hard to stop Mark's tribe. Maybe because many SBC people are listening to Mark, at least in my circles.

Across America there are younger pastors who preach through Bible books expositionally and whose churches are populated by thousands and thousands of young adults most churches who claim the same gospel fail miserably at reaching. These same younger pastors (all of whom are at least my age or younger) sometimes do things methodologically in ways different from their older mentors, including a much greater commitment to church planting in the cities.

Expect the criticism to increase at a greater rate than the rate of return to passionate, gospel preaching that effectively reaches the lost. But in the meantime I will pray that we will reach a tipping point sooner than later and the tide will turn to see a movement that exalts the Word and the gospel in a way that also reaches multitudes in the great urban centers of our nation.

As Rick Warren said years ago, the pioneers always get the arrows. I will cast my lot with the courageous, gospel centered men of God in history who both preached justification by faith and who led in changes in everything from the liturgy (Luther, Wesley, Sankey) to evangelistic methodology (Whitefield, Spurgeon, Graham).

Thank you for the comments about Driscoll. I don't always agree with his style, but as a younger church planter and current seminary student, he is certainly an example. It's disheartening and very discouraging to see our own denomination publicly tear down someone who preaches strong doctrine but refuses to fit into the cookie-cutter mold.

I've never been to Seattle or tried to be a part of the "grunge" scene. I have never lived among the people Mark is attempting to reach.

But from everything I can tell about that culture. Playing nice with people in that culture will never work in getting their attention. What he says works in Seattle because he is in Seattle. If I tried it in our nice suburb, I'd be fried.

Also, for those who don't like harsh sexual language. Who said, "I hope they'd cut off everything (meaning their sexual organ)?" That would be Paul. Who said, "Your righteousness is like menstrual rags?" That would be Isaiah. God inspired both. Other examples could be cited. If we don't like frank talk, there are some passages of scripture we really have to wrestle with.

Thanks for the terrific post. I think the Biblical Recorder in NC has said some things about this too.

What is really sad is that Baptist Press news used to be (in my heyday in ministry) a terrific news source for the denomination that talked about real issues. Now they are, sadly, broaching politics more than the pulpit.

I love Pastor Mark Driscoll as a fine brother in Christ. He existed in a rough and tumble context that needs frank words to express the Gospel. How can anyone, particularly in a growing post-Christian culture, justify attacking a brother in Christ who is leading a church that is reaching people with the Gospel?

I just don't understand that misuse of authority.

Thank you again for a truly humble spirit and post!

You are the Church!
Robert Angison

Many won't leave home to drive to the lake.

Some only sit in the marina complaining about the fishermen and how they fish.

Others stand on the shore to fish the shallows, catching what they always can there.

A few have learned to fish the deep waters, often using as bait what others catch from the shore; they probably have the greater adventure, the awesomer fish stories.

Be who God made you.

David Troublefield
Minister of Education
Lamar Baptist Church
Wichita Falls, TX
david@lbcwf.org

thanks for the wise words and careful explanation.

Ed I thank you for continuing to be a light in SBC circles. I wish we could just work together for the sake of the gospel and stop this petty attacking of other ministries within our convention. I'm disappointed with the shoddy journalism in this article, and am ashamed to be a Southern Baptist today.

While it may seem incongruent to diss the BP and Baptists in general because I 'are' one, their criticism is not surprising. If we (baptists, little b) want to rescue our denomination from decline, then we should ALL be listening to Pastor Mark's sermons via Podcast on a weekly basis and repent from being narrow minded and stupid.

Ed, I can't say it any better than (most of) those whom have already commented. I appreciate your honesty, being able to see past the mainstream, and supporting a friend like Mark.

Thank you, thank you, and thank you.

If I was the devil, I would love it when Christians attack each other. I would make that a big part of my plan. Divide the enemies' forces and have them shoot at each other. Then I'd sit back and watch just for fun.

I want to add my thanks to you Ed for the article. It is truly great to hear from someone who actually knows and speaks into Mark's life. Thanks for what you are doing and the truth you have spoken.